Posted by Billy Rubin on May 22, 2000 at 18:48:51:
In Reply to: Arguing with you is pointless, since you NEVER ever see the point of anything. And since you will resort to childish slander then that is another reason why you are not worth the effort to reply to. (nt) posted by NewPaladin on May 22, 2000 at 16:51:59:
> > > Ok I am sick and tired of those who say: "...well empowerment has its problems, but it is WAY better than without it." without really coming up with any valid reason for saying what they say.
> >
> > My valid reason: Empowerment weeds out priests who do not understand the religion they are supposed to represent.
> >
> > My other valid reason: It assures that IMMs have some control over who speaks for them, and allows them a minimum standard, which they can set.
> >
> > > SO I am going to take the first step to propose a new way for priest-type characters to interact with IMMs.
> > >
> > > - First of all EVERY new character has access to all skills and suplications.
> >
> > This amounts to "Get rid of the current empowerment system". See below.
> >
> > > - Second, all characters are required to have a good description, role and occasional praying notes to their gods.
> >
> > This is already true for empowered characters. Nothing new here.
> >
> > > - Roleplaying is required (DUH!)
> >
> > This is already true for all characters. Nothing new here.
> >
> > > - Constant visits to the temples for prayers, group prayers, coucil meetings, priest meetings, etc... whatever.
> >
> > And who would enforce this? The IMM? Doesn't that require the IMM interaction you claim is impossible to get?
> >
> > > - IMMs would assign Highpriest for their religions that would look after the worshipers. Collect money/gifts/sacrifices, interact, vouch for before the IMMS, limitless possibilities...
> >
> > They have the option to do this right now. However, empowerment is left solely at the IMM's discretion so the religion has continuity from one follower to the next, among other reasons.
> >
> > > - At any point a character can be stripped of powers/supplications/experience whatever, if they are not playing to the expectations of their IMMs.
> >
> > This is already true for all empowered characters. Nothing new here.
> >
> > > That way you are putting the BURDEN on the IMMs to make the system work. It is UNFAIR to put down the rules, then not be around to interact or even ACKNOWLEDGE the existence of those who are trying to worship you.
> >
> > How would your proposal fix this? All it seems to do is open a door for characters to rank up a priest without any supervision.
> >
> > > How in the hec do you guys agree that someone can prove themselves worthy of empowerment under level 10?? yea anyone can ACT like they are roleplaying, and then once empowered, GOODBYE!
> >
> > From what I've seen, not everyone can even do this much. Hence, empowered characters are more rare. By your argument, we should also get rid of cabal inductions, since people can just "RP for a second" to get in.
> >
> > > And now with the Paladins, I can imagive that the occasional visits to get further supplications will be accompanied by these moments of roleplaying.
> >
> > Here's a hint: IMMs can watch you without you knowing. People who drop RP once they leave their shrine don't remain empowered for long.
> >
> > > Now if I am wrong,
> >
> > You are, from where I'm standing.
> >
> > > and people will say that the gods will be watching, then there is no reason to not implement a system like the one I am proposing.
> >
> > Sure there is. In your system, you can rank up a priest without anyone watching at all. This is bad. Empowerment becomes a great advantage once you have it- people know what it means, and it establishes a relationship with your IMM for future interactions. The system requires patience, but not more patience than perfecting skills and such. It's much easier to play an empowered character than an invoker, as an example. When you can provide a system that places some actual checks on a character's roleplay, post it.