Posted by Khiravn on May 24, 2000 at 11:59:16:
In Reply to: My take. posted by Proud Blade(VIP) on May 24, 2000 at 11:23:33:
> As far as the claims that sleep works virtually all the time, that simply isn't true at all for AP's,
I agree. And, it isn't a 99% chance of kill after sleep for AP's, either.
**and it's tricky for necros.
I disagree. I didn't find anything, at all, tricky about it. Someone is slept, then scourged/poisoned/cursed/summoned to a closed room if possible/forgotten. I don't think they're going to survive. I landed, easily, 80% of my sleep spells as a necro, and I am serious here - I can only think of once that someone survived it when someone else didn't intervene (stupid groupmate attacking early, gangbanging enemies coming to distract me). I don't think this took a particular amount of skill on my part, I think it is an easily-abused spell, like hold person used to be, or the old invoker spells used to be.
> Of course, necros and APs are among the game's more powerful classes at higher ranks anyway.
Agreed. And, for reasons you listed (level/save differential) necros probably balance out once they hit 47, and start fighting competent people with levels above them (I didn't play a necro til 47, so I don't know, but fighting against them I don't recall a spectre landing a sleep on me).
(With conjurers.) A little tweak probably couldn't hurt.
Yeah, I know, it's more complicated than me just saying "kill sleep." It's not as though any idiot can play a necromancer. I don't think of myself as an idiot, but I died in droves to the rager gangs before I beat it into my head that I needed to stone/shield/aura/fly (at least) every damned time and *not* charge after them when I'm tiger clawed/unprotected/lusting after the kill :P But I do think sleep makes it laughably easy to kill, and does make any idiot a mass killer (as seen by the old pk lists, which had plenty of idiot necros), and do think that the good players don't need something like sleep to make necros good (but with sleep, they're devestating). So, my suggestions are, elaborated:
1. Kill sleep.
2. Make sleep easier to resist, like hold.
3. Make sleep a higher ranked spell, and cost more mana (since it is very close to a sure kill), post-40.
4. Make sleep unaffected by spellcraft.
5. Make sleep dissipitate after you're at small cuts instead of further down.
6. Make sleep dissipitate after you're damaged, like bard sleep is (used to be?).
Anyway, those are just at the top of my head, and I'm sure they might be easily picked apart on further reflection, but I attribute much of the imbalance between good/evil (and it is there) to sleep. :P Honest.