Cliff's notes on Honor

Cliff's notes on Honor:
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Posted by Shokai(IMM) on September 19, 2000 at 03:17:04:

In Reply to: Let me ask this question about Honor (no this is not a rehash) posted by Well. on September 19, 2000 at 01:49:42:

First I want to say these are only my opinions on honor...and that Balgrimnr may have a different view. I'm not trying to give a handbook to people on what honor is and what it isn't...but I will try to clarify a little bit for you.

> I hear alot of people saying that the Ehren guard power is not honorable. Or that the way it is used by leika is not honorable (knowingly choosing to only attack people who have zero, or close to zero, readiness).

This is a bit of a misconception on thier part...it's a belief that has been created due to a bit of fictional nobility seen in the chivilary of such movies as First Knight, Excalibur and what not. However in CF, well...c'mon think of it as a different realm if you will...one where you should be ready for an attack at any moment...I once had someone accuse me of having no honor due to me assassinating them, and not giving them fair chance. This kind of thinking is similiar to telling someone "You only beat me because you're better than I am...if I were better than you, I would've won."..and trying to guilt them with it. As for giving someone a fair chance, I see it this way...if you want a chance to fully prep yourself, offer a duel...or accept a duel. Otherwise, you fight by the rules of the land...which are pretty unforgiving.

> I hear other people (including shokai) saying that that is not the right outlook on Honor. That Balgrimnr's Honor is different.

Honor is honor is honor is honor. The basic principle of 'honor' doesn't change...regardless of which god presides over it. The biggest thing about honor, is that it's something that comes from within, not something that another entity governs over you. You make your choices and decide if they're honorable or not....if they're not, expect a smack down.

> I see two tatted, titled, followers of the Ehren guard.

> And I have interacted with them both on a number of occasions.

> My question is....If all of these people have the wrong concept on what honor is....why arent the Priests/tatted followers of the God of Honor trying to educate them?

Maybe because most of the people don't ask about it in game? Maybe because it's not in either of their roles to educate people on honor? Maybe simply because no matter how many times you explain honor, people either have it or don't, they either understand it...or don't.

> I don't see that. I see only people waiting until someone is at half health, logging in after a crash, wish zero protections up, and force-dueling them. Then refusing to speak with them.

I'll compare this to someone seeing a single white buffalo and declaring all buffalo white. I've watched Leika a lot, and I can pretty confidently say that half of the complaints people have about her and force duel is hype and trumped up. As for people not having thier protections up...c'mon, Thera's an unforgiving place..you should always, always, always be expecting to fight if you have people in pk range. I can't begin to stress the importance of the 'who pk' command.

> Ok. So people wont get to know the "right way" to look at honor in game. I can accept that.
> Can someone please explain it here then?

*ponder* I'm leary to do so, for the simple fact that trying to explain honor is like trying to explain rolling one's tongue...I can do it, I can make it poetic or technical, but it all comes down to either you do it, or you don't.

> If for no other reason than to shut up the people who claim the power is not honorable.

People will always bitch about that power...and others, it's part of the joy of the game.

> That, And I really do not have a clue, and would like to know, and have been shot down in char when I have tried to find out.

*ponder* Here's my advice to you, try your best to be honorable, think on what I've said here and in other posts...as well as what others have said. Then approach one of the followers of Balgrimnr in the game, when playing an honorable the best you can, and discuss it with them...see what insights they have to share, think about the questions they ask, and your answers (whether right or wrong)...if you do this, you should have a playable grasp of it.

Hope this helped.

"Dancing in your darkness
dancing in your fears
forgetting all your hidden monsters
shedding all your tears
dancing in your darkness
dancing in your fears
forgetting all your hidden monsters
shedding all your fears."
- Cruxshadows

Follow Ups:

You contradict yourself. Graatch(VIP) 07:20:22 9/19/2000 (6)
- a tad dishonest? (and other amusing phrases) Shokai(IMM) 21:30:52 9/19/2000 (0)
- Some thoughts.. (Shokai, flame me please if I'm deluded. ;) ) Tharena 10:49:25 9/19/2000 (2)
  - *Hands Tharena a manana and nods his approval* Creodin 11:17:24 9/19/2000 (0)
  - You've driven me nuts in the past Tharena.. but that was extremely well put. (n/t) The First Apostle 11:03:26 9/19/2000 (0)
- Tenets of Honor in 1000 words or less.. The First Apostle 08:15:16 9/19/2000 (1)
  - ugh what I mean by this... TFA 08:50:16 9/19/2000 (0)
You wine about force duel, why? Because those good are beating the hell outta you? DAMNIT, try to play a EVIL honorable and be a follower of Balgrimnr! N/T Grummore 07:08:15 9/19/2000 (0)

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Comments:	> > First I want to say these are only my opinions on honor...and that Balgrimnr may have a different view. I'm not trying to give a handbook to people on what honor is and what it isn't...but I will try to clarify a little bit for you. > > I hear alot of people saying that the Ehren guard power is not honorable. Or that the way it is used by leika is not honorable (knowingly choosing to only attack people who have zero, or close to zero, readiness). > This is a bit of a misconception on thier part...it's a belief that has been created due to a bit of fictional nobility seen in the chivilary of such movies as First Knight, Excalibur and what not. However in CF, well...c'mon think of it as a different realm if you will...one where you should be ready for an attack at <b>any</b> moment...I once had someone accuse me of having no honor due to me assassinating them, and not giving them fair chance. This kind of thinking is similiar to telling someone <i>"You only beat me because you're better than I am...if I were better than you, I would've won."</i>..and trying to guilt them with it. As for giving someone a fair chance, I see it this way...if you want a chance to fully prep yourself, offer a duel...or accept a duel. Otherwise, you fight by the rules of the land...which are pretty unforgiving. > > I hear other people (including shokai) saying that that is not the right outlook on Honor. That Balgrimnr's Honor is different. > Honor is honor is honor is honor. The basic principle of 'honor' doesn't change...regardless of which god presides over it. The biggest thing about honor, is that it's something that comes from within, not something that another entity governs over you. You make your choices and decide if they're honorable or not....if they're not, expect a smack down. > > I see two tatted, titled, followers of the Ehren guard. > > And I have interacted with them both on a number of occasions. > > My question is....If all of these people have the wrong concept on what honor is....why arent the Priests/tatted followers of the God of Honor trying to educate them? > Maybe because most of the people don't ask about it in game? Maybe because it's not in either of their roles to educate people on honor? Maybe simply because no matter how many times you explain honor, people either have it or don't, they either understand it...or don't. > > I don't see that. I see only people waiting until someone is at half health, logging in after a crash, wish zero protections up, and force-dueling them. Then refusing to speak with them. > I'll compare this to someone seeing a single white buffalo and declaring all buffalo white. I've watched Leika a lot, and I can pretty confidently say that half of the complaints people have about her and force duel is hype and trumped up. As for people not having thier protections up...c'mon, Thera's an unforgiving place..you should <b>always, always, always</b> be expecting to fight if you have people in pk range. I can't begin to stress the importance of the 'who pk' command. > > Ok. So people wont get to know the "right way" to look at honor in game. I can accept that. > > Can someone please explain it here then? > ponder I'm leary to do so, for the simple fact that trying to explain honor is like trying to explain rolling one's tongue...I can do it, I can make it poetic or technical, but it all comes down to either you do it, or you don't. > > If for no other reason than to shut up the people who claim the power is not honorable. > People will always bitch about that power...and others, it's part of the joy of the game. > > That, And I really do not have a clue, and would like to know, and have been shot down in char when I have tried to find out. > ponder Here's my advice to you, try your best to be honorable, think on what I've said here and in other posts...as well as what others have said. Then approach one of the followers of Balgrimnr in the game, when playing an honorable the best you can, and discuss it with them...see what insights they have to share, think about the questions they ask, and your answers (whether right or wrong)...if you do this, you should have a playable grasp of it. > Hope this helped. > <i>"Dancing in your darkness > dancing in your fears > forgetting all your hidden monsters > shedding all your tears > dancing in your darkness > dancing in your fears > forgetting all your hidden monsters > shedding all your fears."</i> > - Cruxshadows

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