Let me show you what a contradiction looks like.

July 05, 2017 12:51PM
Here is your general account of events:

Skip forward 40 hours (with no dwarves dying :D) or so, and I log in to go get some of my gear back, get to a dwarf and he is like Kinslayer! (again out of the blue yay nice shit).
Apparently someone noticed I wasnt a kinslayer and decided to 'fix it', but from an IC point of view, its just dwarves hating on Ghrimmli because he's black or what ever. - So I follow that rp path, because hell its in my role and shit, Ludan tries to kill me again (he already chased me around pre hero I think), so I am like this dude has to go down, you know thats what you do when people try to pk you. So I get a friend, because ludan calls guards, and go to kill him, just when I'm starting on Ludan, I get hit with spec loss/loss of inherents. (I did play for another couple of days after this, as I was able to play Kaiden for some relief from the suckiness),

Here is part of your breakdown of events:

>>> Did I get attacked multiple times by Ludan?
>>> Did I Get attacked and killed by the Dwarven Guildmaster in Galadon when I was on 250hps?

You killed some dwarves and eventually Ludan came after you. The Dwarven Guildmaster also came after you. At this point, you did not have the kinslayer title, though you had already been killing dwarves. It must be true that you had been killing dwarves, especially since you said you expected to receive the title.

I got kinslayer title one day (Meh but not really unexpected)

Great, so you went unpunished for being a kinslayer for awhile and eventually you logged in and had the kinslayer title. So you went from being unpunished but deserving of punishment to being punished. So, you started from this state:

You were a kinslayer but did not get punished for it.



Oh. But... you said... wait, maybe this next sentence will be something you agree with.
Then you got punished for it but you couldn't figure out an RP angle to now be a kinslayer when you weren't previously....



But... you said... wait, maybe you're saying it's wrong that you didn't know the RP angle now that you were a kinslayer when you weren't previously. So are you telling me that I am wrong, and you did know how to RP (from Ghrimmli's point of view, obviously) being a kinslayer after having previously not been a kinslayer?

Yes 100% I can think of 50 ways to get my specs back and rp the character, farm more juicy imm exp probably get a tattoo as well. NONE of them are appropriate to the character of Ghrimmli

Okay, so you could have RP'd your way out of it, it's just that you couldn't have RP'd your way out of it if you were Ghrimmli. Wait, how is the former RP'ing your way out of it if you are not doing so as Ghrimmli? You say Ghrimmli couldn't do it because...

We made a mistake, so we fixed that mistake (Ignore the 80 hours of life/rp inbetween) - So uhmn, all those interactions I had with those dwarves in the meantime, they were meaningless? 'Well you could think of it as them not recognising you' - The hideous drunken dwarf, with no face, known through out the lands as Kingslayer and Blacksmith, and on multiple occasions they traded with him unknown?

Ah, because all of those interactions with the dwarves in the meantime were meaningless. All of those interactions with NPC dwarves which, from a role perspective, you could honestly have easily ignored. Though, this sounds a lot like you not knowing how to RP being a kinslayer after having not been a kinslayer when you should have been. Didn't you already say ^^^WRONG to that? Yes, you did, and you can scroll up to read it. You further touched on this point, much like I'm sure you enjoy touching little boys (you dirty priest, you), by saying:

So by simply fixing it unannounced with no reason behind it other than an imm noticing dwarf kill numbers and non kinslayer (like no echos nothing) basically wiped out the last 40 hours of RP, oh hey guy I notice you stopped killing dwarves and shit since you became Kingslayer, but I'm going to retroactively punish you out of the blue because its not cool to kill dwarves and you should be a kinslayer. GREAT I GET IT. But I Wasnt a Kinslayer, and I could Kinship, IN game the DWARVES LOVED ME ENOUGH TO KINSHIP - ALL OF THEM - But Jeeves it was a mistake (It doesnt matter from the characters point of view that it was a fuck up, get it?)

Got it, so the above two quotes (especially the one about how you interacted with dwarves that didn't treat you like a kinslayer) should make you agree with my statement:

because NPCs weren't treating you like a kinslayer.

Let's see what you said to that.


...I thought they weren't?

This is all sounding pretty whacky. Let's just get back to the breakdown.

>>> Did I log on after many levels and no dwarf killing to randomly walk to the inn with Kinslayer title and 0 echoes or explanation?

I don't think you needed an explanation, considering you knew you had already slain enough dwarves to warrant a kinslayer title.

>>> Did I rp a neutral dwarf who is an arms dealer and understands war is a thing?

How is this relevant?

>>> Did I play on regardless and simply incorporate it into my role that Ghrimmli hated the Akan/Mortorn kings for being cursed to follow the same war for 6 ages?

You incorporated into your role that Ghrimmli hated the Akan/Morton kings for being cursed to follow the same war regardless of the fact that you RP'd a neutral dwarf who is an arms dealer and understands war is a thing?


How am I supposed to understand those two bullet points being separated? I had typed up a lot more, but I think there's plenty enough for you to consider right now before we continue.

pls respond
Subject Author Views Posted

I'm out Ghrimmli/Kaiden/Vortalis (n/t)

wishore 523 June 29, 2017 12:20PM

Dude. One character!

Isildur(VIP) 583 June 29, 2017 12:23PM

9th circle of hell and most of silent tower (n/t)

wishore 400 June 29, 2017 12:25PM

Re: 9th circle of hell and most of silent tower

Isildur(VIP) 547 June 29, 2017 03:07PM


wishore 525 June 29, 2017 04:22PM

Re: Nah

Isildur(VIP) 496 June 29, 2017 04:41PM

Re: Nah

wishore 502 June 29, 2017 04:52PM

WTF SPEC LOSS???? (n/t)

Kstatida 346 June 30, 2017 03:29AM

Two small Imm mistakes

wishore 478 July 01, 2017 05:40AM

No RP shit other than straight up brain damage justifies spec loss

Kstatida 397 July 04, 2017 04:37AM

Any alignment change

wishore 400 July 04, 2017 08:23AM

Sup loss is justified

Kstatida 391 July 05, 2017 12:36AM

Apparently not :D (n/t)

wishore 361 July 05, 2017 05:47AM

Which is why I don't do betrayers

Kstatida 382 July 05, 2017 08:07AM

You can do both and you don't need strong English skills

zannon 401 July 05, 2017 09:57AM

Lol I played an arial once

wishore 381 July 05, 2017 10:59AM

Re: Two small Imm mistakes

wraith 411 July 04, 2017 04:13AM

Well because dwarves have kinship Chris

wishore 398 July 04, 2017 08:21AM

Everyone has kinship.

Matrik 409 July 04, 2017 10:49AM

Really??? Holyshit learn something new every day

wishore 409 July 04, 2017 11:04AM

Let me explain that for you.

Stevers 430 July 04, 2017 10:51AM

Fuck that was hilarious (n/t)

Kstatida 356 July 05, 2017 12:37AM

I'm going to boink your mom. (n/t)

Matrik 335 July 04, 2017 10:51AM

Please Doug Dimma-don't do that. n/t

Stevers 364 July 04, 2017 10:53AM

Re: Well because dwarves have kinship Chris

wraith 392 July 04, 2017 09:42AM

You ooc outted yourself like within 5 mins of meeting me :D

wishore 382 July 04, 2017 10:00AM

Re: You ooc outted yourself like within 5 mins of meeting me :D

wraith 385 July 04, 2017 10:16AM

Yeah maybe (n/t)

wishore 349 July 04, 2017 10:19AM

Consequences aren't fair! (n/t)

MiyagiYojimbo 357 July 01, 2017 08:43AM

Asswipe ^

Lokith 419 July 01, 2017 11:29AM

Consequences are 100% ok

wishore 441 July 01, 2017 09:00AM

Bullshit. You're not "down with that as a player man ofc" -- if you were, you wouldn't have rage deleted 3 different characters. You talk a lot about things IC, yet your in game decisions all come from OOC bum bruising.

Stevers 371 July 04, 2017 09:07AM


wishore 392 July 04, 2017 10:09AM

...two of your characters were rolled for the purpose of aiding your first character?

Stevers 397 July 04, 2017 10:15AM


wishore 388 July 04, 2017 10:17AM

Depends on how the IMMs feel about power-gamey stuff.

Stevers 396 July 04, 2017 10:48AM

Re: Depends on how the IMMs feel about power-gamey stuff.

wishore 400 July 04, 2017 11:22AM

Rolling chars like this feels like grounds for a perma ban

Quas 386 July 05, 2017 11:49AM


wishore 373 July 05, 2017 11:55AM

Dude you're fine

Kstatida 369 July 06, 2017 01:41AM

What an argument: It's fine because I can do it. n/t

Stevers 350 July 06, 2017 10:59AM

You find it strange that pragmatic reasoning comes from a Russian and not an American?

Kstatida 366 July 07, 2017 02:29AM

Pragmatic? "It's fine; I do it all the time" is hardly pragmatic, you know? Those are top-tier powergame actions despite how frequently you do them. n/t

Stevers 329 July 07, 2017 08:32AM

Powergaming is pragmatic, you know

Kstatida 367 July 07, 2017 10:58AM

On a bit more serious note though, refer to what "pragmatism" as philosophy means

Kstatida 346 July 07, 2017 11:00AM

The Irony Being

wishore 366 July 07, 2017 11:13AM


MiyagiYojimbo 378 July 06, 2017 04:54AM

And even more

Kstatida 368 July 06, 2017 05:36AM

Diabolical :D

wishore 359 July 06, 2017 05:58AM

It all makes sense now. Everything about you makes sense now.

Stevers 361 July 06, 2017 11:00AM

Guilty of not doing that

Kstatida 369 July 06, 2017 07:58AM

If I was to play only one character - within 2 chars everyone would know which is mine

wishore 365 July 06, 2017 04:58AM

Instead of outing one character at a time, you choose to out three characters at a time. How is that not breaking the same rule?

Stevers 372 July 06, 2017 11:07AM


wishore 337 July 06, 2017 11:10AM

The point is that, one character or three characters, your characters will always out themselves. You can't help it; you play the same way each time. If you want some advice from me, master of not outing myself, it would be

Stevers 347 July 06, 2017 11:17AM


wishore 339 July 06, 2017 11:33AM

I've interacted with some your characters in the past, and let me tell you something buddy

Stevers 369 July 07, 2017 08:35AM

I'd like to apply for the plants thing please where do I send resume? n-t

jalim 349 July 07, 2017 11:24AM

Re: I'd like to apply for the plants thing please where do I send resume? n-t

MiyagiYojimbo 375 July 08, 2017 12:42AM

I ran a horticultural program for several years. =(. n/t

jalim 326 July 08, 2017 03:29AM

Cool! I didn't know that!

MiyagiYojimbo 362 July 08, 2017 04:20AM

Re: I've interacted with some your characters in the past, and let me tell you something buddy

wishore 329 July 07, 2017 09:12AM

Multi charring (n/t)

Quas 344 July 05, 2017 12:10PM

Re: Multi charring

wishore 407 July 05, 2017 12:15PM

Are you CW? n/t

jalim 356 July 05, 2017 12:28PM


wishore 381 July 05, 2017 12:33PM

Re: ????

MiyagiYojimbo 348 July 05, 2017 11:56PM

Yeah, the problem is your timeline of events is out of sync with the reality.

wishore 370 July 06, 2017 04:12AM

I was about to post that exact same subject in response to one of your posts. Crazy! n/t

Stevers 322 July 06, 2017 11:13AM

Nah the two of you + Jalim are being super aggressive

wishore 353 July 06, 2017 11:58AM

I stopped thinking about it when I noticed you were Kov. Carry on sir. n/t

jalim 369 July 06, 2017 12:08PM

Yeah not me (n/t)

wishore 349 July 06, 2017 12:09PM

Oh, sorry, I was assigning meaning to your words

MiyagiYojimbo 355 July 06, 2017 04:47AM


wishore 346 July 06, 2017 04:50AM

You rolled a character with the intent to cheat for yourself, but you ended up being too incompetent to even do that correctly. It's borderline cheating because you tried; it's not "okay" just because you sucked at it. n/t

Stevers 354 July 06, 2017 11:12AM


wishore 358 July 06, 2017 11:25AM

It's pretty far past borderline. n/t

jalim 335 July 06, 2017 02:33AM

Farming Cabal XP with a main in Empire and an alt in Fortress doing back and forth retrievals probably. I'm sure it's justifiable though, you know, that awesome RP you do between your three heroes between. n/t

jalim 334 July 05, 2017 12:00PM

What would be wrong with that? (n/t)

wishore 347 July 05, 2017 12:09PM

How dare you debait?!

MiyagiYojimbo 387 July 01, 2017 09:58PM

Logs or you're lying! FULL EXPERIENCE. n/t

jalim 385 June 29, 2017 01:24PM

Logs by themselves so much work :D Annotated maps for all area explore :D (n/t)

wishore 383 June 29, 2017 01:34PM

Logs are so much work? All you have to do is copy paste. Or do you mean doctoring logs is so much work?

Stevers 371 July 04, 2017 09:03AM

Oh I assumed this was a joke? Regarding Hell logs ? (n/t)

wishore 360 July 04, 2017 10:11AM

What you should have assumed is that I'm an idiot

Stevers 371 July 04, 2017 10:16AM

Oh no the simple line that jaded me was

wishore 362 July 04, 2017 10:22AM

Also, 80 hours to fix the mistake? Really? You're not fudging that number AT ALL? n/t

Stevers 371 July 04, 2017 10:46AM

I dunno the exact timings man the char was 170 hours old (n/t)

wishore 345 July 04, 2017 11:14AM

You keep using exact amount of hours as if you did know, so I think you can see why I am confused about that. n/t

Stevers 346 July 04, 2017 11:19AM

So you were jaded because they fixed their mistake? I understand that you had to go from RPing one angle to RPing essentially the opposite.

Stevers 354 July 04, 2017 10:44AM

Re: So you were jaded because they fixed their mistake? I understand that you had to go from RPing one angle to RPing essentially the opposite.

wishore 367 July 04, 2017 11:03AM

I don't understand. Was Ghrimmli supposed to be a kinslayer or not?

Stevers 344 July 04, 2017 11:17AM

So thats a no then?

wishore 384 July 04, 2017 11:33AM

No, it was not a no. In case you didn't realize it, you never asked me a yes or no question.

Stevers 347 July 04, 2017 02:42PM

Re: No, it was not a no. In case you didn't realize it, you never asked me a yes or no question.

wishore 379 July 04, 2017 03:56PM

Oh it is 40 hours now? I thought it was 80 hours? Seems like that time has been cut in half.

Stevers 366 July 04, 2017 09:16PM

Yeah Stevers

wishore 366 July 05, 2017 05:12AM

Instead of blurting out "WRONG!" you could instead tell me what is right. n/t

Stevers 361 July 05, 2017 09:19AM

I spelt it out for you with steps and shit

wishore 366 July 05, 2017 11:05AM

Let me show you what a contradiction looks like.

Stevers 375 July 05, 2017 12:51PM

No you are still wrong

wishore 391 July 05, 2017 01:58PM

Re: No you are still wrong

Stevers 368 July 05, 2017 02:16PM


MiyagiYojimbo 360 July 06, 2017 12:34AM

This is more or less accurate except

wishore 369 July 06, 2017 04:29AM

After having said it was 80 hours since killing dwarves, then having said it was 40 hours since killing dwarves,you are back to saying it was 100 hours since killing dwarves. Which one is it, wishore? n/t

Stevers 351 July 06, 2017 10:55AM


wishore 352 July 06, 2017 11:12AM

Show me proof of both claims or stop pretending to not be lying. n/t

Stevers 346 July 06, 2017 11:19AM

Re: Show me proof of both claims or stop pretending to not be lying. n/t

wishore 359 July 06, 2017 11:54AM

Nice, 100 hours pre-punishment confirmed. I see roughly 40 hours until deletion, but I don't see where kinship was re-applied?

Stevers 365 July 06, 2017 03:04PM

Kinship was reapplied with the title change at around 120? hours

wishore 356 July 06, 2017 03:26PM

Are you two registered at Crate and Barrel? (n/t)

Frosty 354 July 05, 2017 02:31PM

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