My thoughts on your thoughts: health insurance

December 26, 2016 12:17AM
Quote

I can agree with more competition: but what seemed appealing about Obamacare was moving towards universal coverage. Many other rich countries have more or less universal health coverage so you can't be "too poor" to get medical treatment for illnesses, up to a point.

Re: premiums rising in the past few years: I think it's because Obamacare covers "preventive care" on top of the usual healthcare costs? In the long-term preventive care should reduce the total costs, but in the short term it would represent a sudden increase in premiums. The other issues might be the extra requirements e.g. computerized records and such, again these are long-term investments which cost money now. [www.thebalance.com]

I actually work in healthcare so I have a bit more of an understanding of the health insurance system than most.

One thing you don't get about US health insurers before Obamacare is that *THERE WAS NO REQUIREMENT THEY GIVE COVERAGE TO ANYBODY*. So long story short, the private health insurers would ONLY accept profitable clientele (young, healthy, and rich people) while denying people with "pre-existing conditions" (i.e. the only people who needed health insurance - the poor, the sick, the elderly) - these people would be kicked to the curb and had to rely on Emergency Rooms as their primary form of care (which are legally bound to treat you without asking for your credit card first). This created a whole mess in healthcare where the young and healthy and rich got great deals, while everybody else was dumped onto Medicare and Hospitals who ended up footing the bill for everything. Essentially, health insurers were parasites who took only the profitable stuff and dumped the people who actually needed them on somebody else. It was a hugely regressive system designed to make wealthy shareholders richer than ever while adding NOTHING of benefit to actual health providers - the State literally took on all the "risk" while they took on all the "reward". It got so bad the government had to cap earnings on health insurance companies to 10% - otherwise they had far too much incentive to deny legitimate claims and engage in other shady behavior to pad their profit margins further.

Obamacare was designed to solve this problem, and it did so very well. In the process, the health insurance companies became a LOT less profitable. They mitigate this issue by increasing premiums, but the OVERALL cost of the system is far better and more equitable. Emergency Rooms, for example, are no longer the unprofitable money-sucking black holes they were before the ACA, when they had to bear a lot of the treatment costs themselves - as a result, more and more hospitals can afford to open ERs, and the ERs got nicer with better equipment and more qualified personnel. While you are likely to pay more in health premiums overall, your grandma is less likely to get denied by three insurers and ignored by her existing insurer, resulting in your family having to pay the entirety of the radiation treatment she's getting alone. Etc and so forth.
Subject Author Posted

For vortexmagus

PaulO December 20, 2016 11:31AM

fuck double posted (n/t)

vortexmagus December 21, 2016 05:28PM

Like your sources. (n/t)

Frosty December 21, 2016 07:10PM

So I actually like debating with you

vortexmagus December 21, 2016 05:28PM

To summarize...

Death_Claw March 20, 2017 09:37AM

You do realize that their conclusion is "We think it was Russia" not "It was Russia"

Nurok December 22, 2016 10:24AM

Well, there's a reason for that.

MiyagiYojimbo December 22, 2016 02:11AM

So while your article is interesting, I'm not sure where your line of thought is leading to here

vortexmagus December 26, 2016 01:36AM

Sorry, Vortex, just saw this.

MiyagiYojimbo December 31, 2016 12:04PM

Interesting, curious to see how this pans out (n/t)

starbright December 22, 2016 02:21AM

Nice reads, thanks for sharing

starbright December 21, 2016 11:07PM

To me, whether or not Russia hacked the emails isn't the issue.

Jib December 22, 2016 09:04AM

Thanks: good to get your views

starbright December 22, 2016 09:47AM

Re: Thanks: good to get your views

Jib December 22, 2016 10:33AM

Some of these seem reasonable to me

starbright December 23, 2016 11:01AM

My thoughts on your thoughts: Everything else

vortexmagus December 26, 2016 12:46AM

Re: My thoughts on your thoughts: Everything else

starbright December 26, 2016 06:39AM

Couple of remarks on your couple of thoughts, sporadic

Kstatida December 26, 2016 01:48AM

My thoughts on your thoughts: health insurance

vortexmagus December 26, 2016 12:17AM

If you behave well enough, you might even get normal healthcare someday

Kstatida December 26, 2016 01:30AM

We agree on this. I think Obamacare was terrible, its just a big step up from the shitshow that came before it, that Trump wants to go back to. (n/t)

vortexmagus December 26, 2016 01:34AM

You mean when working people had affordable healthcare?

Rhyaldrin December 26, 2016 02:26AM

That's the core of the problem

Kstatida December 26, 2016 03:21AM

I think it's quite specific to the US. Most other countries (even developing ones) have healthcare coverage for emergencies

starbright December 26, 2016 05:22AM

Singapore is unique and interesting

Kstatida December 26, 2016 05:30AM

Yeah the country has a large population of migrant workers who do not have welfare privileges

starbright December 26, 2016 06:51AM

Yeah, in that case our views are aligned re: obamacare, but a daring proposal if I may

starbright December 26, 2016 01:21AM

About 1)...if you're ever bored and want some interesting reading, check out the Pharm companies efforts to keep medicinal marijuana from being legalized. NT

Sam December 26, 2016 01:49AM

This seems exactly like the sorts of things pharma companies might be incentivized to do! (n/t)

starbright December 26, 2016 05:15AM

I'm not sure there is market research available

Kstatida December 26, 2016 01:53AM

I mean, I completely agree, Obamacare is inherently flawed and universal healthcare is far more efficient/effective.

vortexmagus December 26, 2016 01:32AM

Some thoughts

Kstatida December 24, 2016 12:46AM

Didn't know that about the TPP, good to know

starbright December 24, 2016 02:07AM

RE: media favoring trump

Nurok December 22, 2016 09:15AM

Good point.For all the retards who bought into it, I guess we have to give a lot of folks credit for seeing through the B.S.

Jib December 22, 2016 09:23AM

That's my favorite thing about this whole election.

MiyagiYojimbo December 22, 2016 01:24PM

Fucking Nexus ruining shit again. God dammit. NT

Sam December 22, 2016 01:29PM

Holy shit! Nice catch, Sam.

MiyagiYojimbo December 22, 2016 01:33PM

I actually wonder

Kstatida December 21, 2016 09:34PM

But, but, but.. the CIA!!!!!

NbM(VIP) December 20, 2016 12:03PM



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