Did you read the article?

May 03, 2017 03:01AM
I've lived in California my entire life, and attended public schools my entire life, including UCSB undergrad and UCB Boalt Hall law school. At every level of my education, we discussed the causes of the civil war, and covered other countries that abolished slavery without war. There was nothing remotely controversial about questioning why the political climate in the US was different than that in Great Britain or Brazil.
In any event, the "controversial" part of Trump's interview was that he made the statement, "People don't realize, you know, the Civil War, you think about it, why? People don't ask that question. But why was there the Civil War? Why could that one not have been worked out?" in the context of Andrew Jackson, who was dead at the time, being "really angry that he saw what was happening with regard to the Civil War, he said, "There's no reason for this.'"

A couple things. First, Andrew Jackson was dead. He didn't see what was happening with regard to the Civil War, and he never said, "there's no reason for this" from his grave. That's alarming because we haven't had a President of the United States before that lacked the historical education and civics knowledge of a pre-teen.
I'm guessing you didn't read the article, because Trump tweeted, "President Andrew Jackson, who died 16 years before the Civil War started, saw it coming and was angry. Would never have let it happen!"

Trump says a lot of dumb stuff. I think his saber rattling against N.Korea is dreadful. He's like a bully picking on the retarded kid during lunch break in elementary school. But talking about whether or not Andrew Jackson saw the Civil War coming? I know I don't know. I consider myself moderately educated, so to me that's a completely fair question. He could very well be wrong, but I still think it is okay to ask.

Second, it's not a novel question. It's not an exaggeration to say that poems, books, lectures, classes, plays, mini series, and movies have all been dedicated to the question of why there was a Civil War, and why "that one could not have been worked out." Again, it's shocking that the President of the United States has never contemplated this question before, and is raising it as thought it were for the first time.
You appear to be unable to imagine any scenario where the Civil War does not happen and slavery still ends in the United States. Do you think it is impossible to change a culture without violence and war, even if you could go back in time?

Third, his manner of speaking about a topic as grave as the Civil War, particularly at a time when people are blindly loyal to a political party more out of tribalism and cultural identity than an educated, intellectual decision, is alarmingly cavalier and ignorant.

I don't know if the above is "controversial," as much as it is shocking.
Eh, that's his whole shtick. He's a populist huckster trying to hit all the hot-button items.

As a side note, your description of "Berkeley liberals" is insulting. Particularly since the majority of the mayhem has been caused by armed out-of-town right wing extremists.
Unless you're talking about agent provocateurs, I think you're on a different planet. Compare the April 27th rally to the April 15th rally, and tell me why one was violent and one wasn't. Is it because of right wing extremists?

Is Eric "Bike Lock" Clanton a right wing extremist? [www.youtube.com]

- Paul
Subject Author Posted

So Rhyaldrin and Trump supporters, how ya like your boy right now? Wants to chill with dictators, wants to repeal the 1st Amendment, can't remember when Andrew Jackson died, doesn't know why the Civil War happened.

Sam May 02, 2017 03:17AM

Comfy and happy. (n/t)

Matrik May 02, 2017 06:34AM

for what it's worth. Re: civil war

PaulO May 02, 2017 03:37AM

Also, this is the same president who dropped bombs on Afghanistan and Syria in the last 45 days. Really trying to settle things without a war, totally. NT

Sam May 02, 2017 05:43AM

GTFOH with that shit.

Sam May 02, 2017 05:38AM

Relax, I wasn't calling you a Berkeley liberal

PaulO May 02, 2017 06:39AM

You are asking a different question than Trump.

Balrahd May 02, 2017 10:27PM

Did you read the article?

PaulO May 03, 2017 03:01AM

Nullification crisis anyone?

Kstatida May 03, 2017 03:09AM

What right wing extremists? (n/t)

Rhyaldrin May 02, 2017 10:59PM

He lost me there, too. (n/t)

Jib May 02, 2017 11:01PM

I'm not a history expert, but no war is started over slavery

Kstatida May 02, 2017 07:26AM

Would you say that Southern states seceded because of fear of losing slavery?

Jib May 02, 2017 08:42AM


Kstatida May 02, 2017 08:58AM

So you are saying that the fear of losing slavery had no impact on any of the Southern states secessions?

Jib May 02, 2017 09:21AM

You ask wrong questions

Kstatida May 02, 2017 09:44AM

I'm not asking the questions to come to a specific conclusion, I'm asking them to have a discussion.

Jib May 02, 2017 11:04AM

And that is easy

Kstatida May 02, 2017 11:15AM

Is it propaganda if its true?

Jib May 02, 2017 12:44PM

What I'm saying is that if the driving force behind south was not slavery but chickenbutts

Kstatida May 02, 2017 09:38PM

Okay, okay, I get it.

Jib May 02, 2017 11:17PM

You're obviously biased and putting words into my mouth

Kstatida May 02, 2017 11:42PM

You're focusing on the wrong things, just to argue now. Okay, let me try this again, removing bias.

Jib May 03, 2017 08:13AM


Kstatida May 03, 2017 08:21AM

We're splitting hairs here. It's okay, I get what you're saying.

Jib May 03, 2017 09:01AM


Kstatida May 03, 2017 09:05AM

Slaves were the WMDs of their day (n/t)

wishore May 03, 2017 08:00AM

Standing for? (n/t)

Kstatida May 03, 2017 08:06AM

I believe WMD stands for

wishore May 03, 2017 08:10AM

Wholesale Method of Distraction. (n/t)

The Faithful of Nazmorghul(VIP) May 26, 2017 04:52PM


PaulO May 02, 2017 08:57AM

Holy Christ, you'd fit right in with the Nazi's and White Nationalists in America. Bravo.

Sam May 02, 2017 07:38AM

You have repeated my statement with your counterarguments, Sam

Kstatida May 02, 2017 07:41AM

You're stupidity has won out, I just can't do it anymore. Just like Sultan on .info, you've driven me from Dio's. Enjoy the throne. NT

Sam May 02, 2017 07:42AM

What the Fuck is wrong with you?

physics May 02, 2017 07:25AM

Wow... maybe that isn't an unfair stereotype of the left being angry and intolerant (n/t)

TJHuron May 02, 2017 04:53PM

This post is why I voted for Trump. God save the King. (n/t)

Matrik May 02, 2017 12:19PM

To be honest, me too.

Jib May 02, 2017 12:45PM

We boys Jib, we boys. (n/t)

Matrik May 02, 2017 12:51PM

Nah, you are what's wrong because you think you know me but you don't.

PaulO May 02, 2017 07:47AM

The problem with you, dude,

Kstatida May 02, 2017 07:50AM

Re: The problem with you, dude, is that you like to think????

physics May 02, 2017 08:09AM

Re: The problem with you, dude, is that you like to think????

PaulO May 02, 2017 08:31AM

Huge issue for us to, if only your mother had tried harder. (n/t)

wishore May 03, 2017 08:09AM

Re: The problem with you, dude, is that you like to think????

Kstatida May 02, 2017 08:11AM

Re: The problem with you, dude, is that you like to think????

physics May 02, 2017 08:19AM

Re: The problem with you, dude, is that you like to think????

Kstatida May 02, 2017 08:21AM

Calmer than you are, dude. (n/t)

Jib May 02, 2017 07:29AM

Much better post.

Sam May 02, 2017 06:52AM

FWIW I think American Civil War had little to do with slavery

Kstatida May 02, 2017 05:30AM

Actual professor of American history discusses this issue with sources:

vortexmagus May 22, 2017 07:24AM

It was all so Abe Lincoln could stop the vampires (n/t)

TJHuron May 02, 2017 06:54PM

I don't see no vampires around, way to go Abe. (n/t)

jhyrbian May 02, 2017 07:01PM

Odin said he'd get rid of the Frost Giants. Though he did get most of them, some remain.

Frosty May 02, 2017 07:10PM

Re: FWIW I think American Civil War had little to do with slavery

Isildur(VIP) May 02, 2017 07:09AM

Despite any notion to the contrary

zannon May 02, 2017 07:38AM

You contradict yourself

Kstatida May 02, 2017 07:43AM

Some things are done for moral reasons, not that russians understand right and wrong. (n/t)

NbM(VIP) May 02, 2017 08:13AM

Define right

Kstatida May 02, 2017 08:25AM

Right and wrong is contextual and subjective

zannon May 02, 2017 09:36AM

Great points but : Slavery was considered good and right for Thousands of years

wishore May 03, 2017 09:22AM

Exactly, my good man

Kstatida May 02, 2017 10:50AM

They were willing to let them keep slavery, just not allowing new states to have it. And thus, the Southern states feared losing their majority/power, so they seceded before we could fully abolish it. NT

Sam May 02, 2017 07:40AM

And U.S. - Spain war was started because Maine exploded

Kstatida May 02, 2017 07:29AM

Preserve the Union! (n/t)

PaulO May 02, 2017 07:09AM

LOL. Russians committ genocide on their own people. NT

Sam May 02, 2017 05:38AM

I'm done talking to you long ago

Kstatida May 02, 2017 05:40AM

Like, seriously. You posted that the Civil War wasn't about slavery. LOL. NT

Sam May 02, 2017 05:42AM

I was talking to PaulO

Kstatida May 02, 2017 06:08AM

And you're fucking wrong, you genocidal cuck. Shouldn't you be making sure your wife isn't giving out handjobs for rubles? NT

Sam May 02, 2017 06:15AM

Go fuck yourself

Kstatida May 02, 2017 06:16AM

So sad. You literally have nothing intelligent to say, ever.

Sam May 02, 2017 06:20AM

I've got nothing to say to you, fucking idiot. Not now, not ever.

Kstatida May 02, 2017 06:28AM

Alright, I tried to warn you. NT

Sam May 02, 2017 06:42AM

Yet you still keep posting incredibly stupid shit, over and over and over again. How's it feel to be living in a country where they committ genocide on their own people? NT

Sam May 02, 2017 05:41AM

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